Set-up Air Controlled Spindle and Brake on Bridgeport V2XT

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CarrowMac
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 11:51 am
Acorn CNC Controller: No
Allin1DC CNC Controller: Yes
Oak CNC controller: No
CNC Control System Serial Number: 0008DC111213-0815222803
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: No
CPU10 or CPU7: No

Set-up Air Controlled Spindle and Brake on Bridgeport V2XT

Post by CarrowMac »

Working on a Bridgeport Series 1 V2XT and cannot get the air controls to work.

When air is connected, machine will run the program but the spindle will not turn because the brake will not disengage.

If air is not turned on, the program will run, spindle brake will disengage, however the spindle will continue to increase in speed until the overload switch blows. Feed rate cannot be controlled from the pendant in any way. It is only on/off (and that's if the air is not on).

Here is my most recent report and picture of my wiring diagram
IMG_6264.png
Machine:
Bridgeport Series 1 V2XT w/ DX-32 control

CNCPC Specs:
Intel Core i3-8109U 3.6 GHz processor; 8GB ram; 256 SSD, Windows 11 Pro
NO touchscreen

New Components:
Allin1DC
Centroid encoder cables
Operator Control Panel M39
2000 line DC encoders

Software
MPU12
PLC program is Centroid Standard BP-Boss

Reused Bridgeport Components:
220 vac to 110 vac step down transformer
Servo motor power step down transformer
Main 3 phase fuse
Spindle reversing contactor
Spindle overload
E-Stop relay
24 VDC power supply
Spindle motor fuses
Servo DC power capacitor
Estop contactor
SEM 26lb 11.7A servo motors
cncsnw
Posts: 3763
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 5:48 pm

Re: Set-up Air Controlled Spindle and Brake on Bridgeport V2XT

Post by cncsnw »

Use the PLC Detective source code view to watch what is happening in lines 2634-2645 of the PLC program.

With luck, that will tell you whether OUT9 SpindleBrakeRelease_O is turning on when SpindleEnableOut_O turns on; and with luck it will tell you what condition is causing OUT4 SpeedUpOut_O to turn on.
cnckeith
Posts: 7164
Joined: Wed Mar 03, 2010 4:23 pm
Acorn CNC Controller: Yes
Allin1DC CNC Controller: Yes
Oak CNC controller: Yes
CNC Control System Serial Number: none
DC3IOB: Yes
CNC11: Yes
CPU10 or CPU7: Yes
Contact:

Re: Set-up Air Controlled Spindle and Brake on Bridgeport V2XT

Post by cnckeith »

while you could definitely get this working again, I'd consider installing a VFD and braking resistor and use the air operated brake as a manual function for Tool Changes only.
Need support? READ THIS POST first. http://centroidcncforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=60&t=1043
All Acorn Documentation is located here: viewtopic.php?f=60&t=3397
Answers to common questions: viewforum.php?f=63
and here viewforum.php?f=61
Gear we use but don't sell. https://www.centroidcnc.com/centroid_di ... _gear.html
CarrowMac
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2022 11:51 am
Acorn CNC Controller: No
Allin1DC CNC Controller: Yes
Oak CNC controller: No
CNC Control System Serial Number: 0008DC111213-0815222803
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: No
CPU10 or CPU7: No

Re: Set-up Air Controlled Spindle and Brake on Bridgeport V2XT

Post by CarrowMac »

Ok - found a loose wire which was the problem with my spindle brake. I fixed that and updated the PLC code from ZBrake to SpindleBrake as I had seen in another post and now the spindle brake works as it should.

However, I still have no spindle speed control. Once the spindle starts, it will gain speed until the overload switch trips or I press stop. I also noticed that when the spindle is running there is no Spindle speed registered on the computer screen - it just says 0. Have I failed to wire up something the machine needs?

Thanks -
'CM

Here is my current machine report
cnckeith
Posts: 7164
Joined: Wed Mar 03, 2010 4:23 pm
Acorn CNC Controller: Yes
Allin1DC CNC Controller: Yes
Oak CNC controller: Yes
CNC Control System Serial Number: none
DC3IOB: Yes
CNC11: Yes
CPU10 or CPU7: Yes
Contact:

Re: Set-up Air Controlled Spindle and Brake on Bridgeport V2XT

Post by cnckeith »

when not using a VFD or an Encoder CNC12 doesn't know how fast the spindle is spinning. therefor the spindle rpm display on cnc12 is zero.

to debug the relays, make sure they are clicking and use the alt i screen to make sure cnc12 is sending the command to the relay if so then looks at the solenoid , the solenoid coils and the air motor, the air motors often gum up.
Need support? READ THIS POST first. http://centroidcncforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=60&t=1043
All Acorn Documentation is located here: viewtopic.php?f=60&t=3397
Answers to common questions: viewforum.php?f=63
and here viewforum.php?f=61
Gear we use but don't sell. https://www.centroidcnc.com/centroid_di ... _gear.html
cncsnw
Posts: 3763
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 5:48 pm

Re: Set-up Air Controlled Spindle and Brake on Bridgeport V2XT

Post by cncsnw »

Assuming you do not have a spindle encoder connected, you should change Machine Parameter 78 to zero.

Then CNC12 will display the programmed spindle RPM, when in Auto mode.
cncsnw
Posts: 3763
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 5:48 pm

Re: Set-up Air Controlled Spindle and Brake on Bridgeport V2XT

Post by cncsnw »

What are your goals and expectations for spindle speed control and display on this machine?

As Keith hinted above, the default assumption in standard Centroid PLC programming is that, if there is spindle speed control at all, it is done through a VFD that receives the analog speed command from the Centroid PLC.

At the opposite end of the spectrum is a typical vari-speed knee mill, in which the PLC turns the spindle on and off via forward/reverse contactors, but speed is controlled by the operator, turning the crank on the head. In that setup, the PLC has no ability to change spindle speed, and no way to know what the actual spindle speed is.

Many Bridgeport knee mills, including the V2XT, have an air motor to turn the vari-speed crank. In support of these machines, Centroid provides some "-bp-boss" versions of their PLC programs, which use the spindle speed '+' and '-' keys to power the Bridgeport speed-up and speed-down solenoids (provided the spindle motor is on). These typical Centroid "-bp-boss" programs have no provision for spindle speed feedback, so it is assumed that spindle speed is only controlled manually, by the operator pushing the keys.

The V2XT models did have rudimentary provision for spindle speed feedback: there was usually a 10K potentiometer on the vari-speed shaft. If that potentiometer is wired to the analog input on the Centroid PLC, then one can add code to the PLC program to estimate the spindle speed based on the potentiometer position. At a minimum, that allows the PLC to provide an approximate RPM for CNC12 to display in the status window. If one is a little more ambitious, one can add further code to the PLC program, to attempt to automatically drive the vari-speed up and down until the estimated RPM is acceptably close to the programmed RPM.

I recommend starting with just manual speed control via the '+' and '-' buttons, and no feedback. That will allow you to troubleshoot the speed solenoids and wiring, so that the solenoids turn on when, and only when, they are supposed to. Once that is working, then if you wish, you can look at wiring in the potentiometer and getting an approximate RPM display on the screen. Only once that is working, is it worth experimenting with automatic programmable spindle speed control.
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