Upgrading 1984 Wells Index 820 with Allin1DC

All things related to Centroid Oak, Allin1DC, MPU11 and Legacy products

Moderator: cnckeith

Chevy427z
Posts: 75
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 9:39 am
Acorn CNC Controller: No
Allin1DC CNC Controller: Yes
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: No
CPU10 or CPU7: No
CNC Control System Serial Number: A900999
Location: Clinton, NC, USA
Contact:

Re: Upgrading 1984 Wells Index 820 with Allin1DC

Post by Chevy427z »

Making some headway. Just looking to document my progress.

To answer Marty's question first, about the power supply, yes I wired it exactly as the instructions say. Double and triple checked. All voltages are correct, except V3 (which is empty), instructions say it should be 24V, but it actually reads 30V.

And all the LED's on the ALLINONE are correct.

I was able to test my Y encoder exactly as polaraligned outlined in his video and everything was perfect. Thank you for that video sir! I only checked A and /A and B and /B. His video says that Z isn't important right now, and hard to read anyhow. I haven't checked the Z axis yet, but I am betting that it is fine, too. My buddy still has my X, but hoping to get that back tomorrow.

As you can see in the pictures, I found my DC power supply. Good thing because the PC power supply that I was going to use output nothing when I plugged it in. That'll be a troubleshooting effort for later.

I have managed to get all of the error codes cleared (going step by step in the manual) and have gotten spindlebenchtest.cnc loaded, and watched the axes registers go to zero. And I can get to the MDI screen (indicating that all errors are cleared as per the install manual).

Got to step 4 on page 32, revolving the encoder, and nothing moves on the screen (Fig 4.2.6).
Attachments
20210510_105230.jpg
20210510_105225.jpg
20210510_105211.jpg
20210510_105202.jpg
20210510_105157.jpg
report_0008DC111213-0301212560_2021-05-09_15-47-15.zip
(474.27 KiB) Downloaded 17 times
M400
A900999
CNC12
SYSTEM ID - 0008DC111213-0301212560
cncsnw
Posts: 2080
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 5:48 pm

Re: Upgrading 1984 Wells Index 820 with Allin1DC

Post by cncsnw »

Were all three of your encoders plugged into the Allin1DC when you made the report?

Your report file includes this snapshot of the F3/Encoder screen under the PID Configuration screen:

Code: Select all

      Motor Pos   Type DQOA  ErrCnt   Scale Pos   Type DQOA ErrCnt    ErrCorr
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
X*            0    Std 100-      -            0   None 000-      -          0 
Y*            0    Std 100-      -            0   None 000-      -          0 
Z*            0    Std 100-      -            0   None 000-      -          0 
N*            0    Std 100-      -            0   None 000-      -          0 
N*            0    Std 100-      -            0   None 000-      -          0 
N*            0    Std 100-      -            0   None 000-      -          0 
N             0    Std 000-      -            0   None 000-      -          0 
N             0    Std 000-      -            0   None 000-      -          0 
The "100-" values in the "DQOA" error column indicate a differential error on those encoder inputs: in other words, the Allin1DC is not seeing the differential voltage on the A and B channels of any of the encoders.

The asterisks next to the axis labels for each input indicate either that the index pulse is active on that input, or that there is no signal on the Z channel either.

The levels in your pictures -- high at 3.91 VDC, low at 0.06 VDC -- should work just fine if they are connected properly.

Check and re-check your cables and the assembly of your DE9 plugs.
cncsnw
Posts: 2080
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 5:48 pm

Re: Upgrading 1984 Wells Index 820 with Allin1DC

Post by cncsnw »

If necessary, make yourself a male-to-female DE9 breakout connector which you can plug in, in-line, between an encoder and the Allin1DC.

Then you can use your meter to see what the voltage is on each of the eight wires while you are getting the differential error reported.
Chevy427z
Posts: 75
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 9:39 am
Acorn CNC Controller: No
Allin1DC CNC Controller: Yes
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: No
CPU10 or CPU7: No
CNC Control System Serial Number: A900999
Location: Clinton, NC, USA
Contact:

Re: Upgrading 1984 Wells Index 820 with Allin1DC

Post by Chevy427z »

Thank you for that information!

I have checked these damn cables a dozen times each. I am probably going to be very pissed at myself when I discover that it is something simple, which it usually is.

I was hesitant to include the error report thinking that it wasn't going to help much. I have gotten over that and realize how helpful it is to you folks. And I am learning along the way.

Onward and upward. Thanks again!

Mark

Edited: Forgot to mention that all three encoders were not hooked up at the time, just Y and Z. My buddy still has my X encoder, but I expect to get that back today.
M400
A900999
CNC12
SYSTEM ID - 0008DC111213-0301212560
Chevy427z
Posts: 75
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 9:39 am
Acorn CNC Controller: No
Allin1DC CNC Controller: Yes
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: No
CPU10 or CPU7: No
CNC Control System Serial Number: A900999
Location: Clinton, NC, USA
Contact:

Re: Upgrading 1984 Wells Index 820 with Allin1DC

Post by Chevy427z »

Just had a thought. The only thing I am questioning myself about is the ground/com connections at the encoder. This picture is from the old set up and you can see that there is nothing connected to the "CG" lug, but everything (wire from the DB-9 and pigtail from the machine ground) are tied together on the "G" lug.

I don't have the current picture with me to up load, but I have the cable shield ground and the pig tail inside the housing from machine ground going to "CG" and "com" from lug 2 on the DB-9 going to "G" .

Thoughts?
Attachments
encoder labels close up.jpg
M400
A900999
CNC12
SYSTEM ID - 0008DC111213-0301212560
martyscncgarage
Posts: 8456
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2017 12:01 pm
Acorn CNC Controller: Yes
Allin1DC CNC Controller: Yes
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: Yes
CPU10 or CPU7: Yes
CNC Control System Serial Number: none
Location: Mesa, AZ

Re: Upgrading 1984 Wells Index 820 with Allin1DC

Post by martyscncgarage »

CH probably chassis ground as Marc mentioned earlier.
I would imagine G is 5vdc ground
Your tech checking the encoder should have been able to verify this
Reminder, for support please follow this post: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=383
We can't "SEE" what you see...
Mesa, AZ
Chevy427z
Posts: 75
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 9:39 am
Acorn CNC Controller: No
Allin1DC CNC Controller: Yes
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: No
CPU10 or CPU7: No
CNC Control System Serial Number: A900999
Location: Clinton, NC, USA
Contact:

Re: Upgrading 1984 Wells Index 820 with Allin1DC

Post by Chevy427z »

martyscncgarage wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 10:13 am CH probably chassis ground as Marc mentioned earlier.
I would imagine G is 5vdc ground
Your tech checking the encoder should have been able to verify this
I am understanding what the initials stand for. I am trying to confirm what goes to "G" and what goes to "CG".

If I understand it correctly, the only thing going to "G" is the 5volt ground and the pigtail inside the encoder enclosure goes to "CG", along with the cable shield ground. My Z axis does not have a pig tail going to machine ground, so I am assuming it doesn't need one.

Is this correct?

My tech was no help as he couldn't get to it. I got it back from him today and will be testing myself, expecting to find the same results I did with the Y. Hoping to check the Z soon, too.



Mark
M400
A900999
CNC12
SYSTEM ID - 0008DC111213-0301212560
polaraligned
Posts: 124
Joined: Mon Feb 07, 2011 8:03 pm
Acorn CNC Controller: No
Allin1DC CNC Controller: No
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: Yes
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: Yes
CPU10 or CPU7: No
CNC Control System Serial Number: 1030090103
Location: Montvale, NJ

Re: Upgrading 1984 Wells Index 820 with Allin1DC

Post by polaraligned »

CG is "Case Ground" per spec sheet. You don't need to connect anything to it to get the encoder to work. Just ignore it.

The only connection to the encoder "G" should be pin 2 of the DB9 connector.

Are you sure you are counting the pin numbers correctly on the DB9 connector? The pin numbers are usually raised numbers on the solder side and often difficult to see easily.

When you have the unit powered up with the Centroid, do you get +5v between the encoder V terminal and the G terminal? If that is correct, use your meter to carefully measure between the A and /A, and the B and /B terminals at the encoder and make sure you have at least 3 volt difference between those.
Chevy427z
Posts: 75
Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2021 9:39 am
Acorn CNC Controller: No
Allin1DC CNC Controller: Yes
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: No
CPU10 or CPU7: No
CNC Control System Serial Number: A900999
Location: Clinton, NC, USA
Contact:

Re: Upgrading 1984 Wells Index 820 with Allin1DC

Post by Chevy427z »

polaraligned wrote: Tue May 11, 2021 5:10 pm
When you have the unit powered up with the Centroid, do you get +5v between the encoder V terminal and the G terminal? If that is correct, use your meter to carefully measure between the A and /A, and the B and /B terminals at the encoder and make sure you have at least 3 volt difference between those.
It might be time to cut my losses.

I can't get anything to repeat. One time I fire up the ALLINONE and all three axes show errors. Then the next, only one of them, then I spin one and all three show bad.

I can't get consistent voltage readings either. I've rechecked all my cables and everything is fine (pin numbering specifically) I get the 5 volts as expected. Checking pairs I get roughly 71 - 72 mV on one and 2.08 - 2.2 on the other, clearly outside the specs polar described above. Other times I get over 3 volts. I have checked at the encoder end and also coming directly out of the back of the DB9 at the ALLINONE.

I've been watching the video of swapping out the encoders, seems pretty straight forward. I just hate to spend that kind of money to find that there is a problem elsewhere.
Attachments
report_0008DC111213-0301212560_2021-05-14_19-26-49.zip
(476.61 KiB) Downloaded 16 times
M400
A900999
CNC12
SYSTEM ID - 0008DC111213-0301212560
cncsnw
Posts: 2080
Joined: Wed Mar 24, 2010 5:48 pm

Re: Upgrading 1984 Wells Index 820 with Allin1DC

Post by cncsnw »

Can you measure the current draw of your old encoders? Maybe they are overloading the 5VDC supply.

Though if that were the case, I would expect the Allin1DC unit to shut down, since that is also its logic power....
Post Reply