Mazak Oak retrofit - please help advise on parts needed

[ashesman]

So, looks like the DYN4 might be out for spindle driving. Seems maximum RPM is 5000. The machine can currently do 6000 RPM, I was hoping to even squeeze a little more out of it like 6500. So I guess I am back looking at trying to find a vector VFD that supports AC servo motors.

Can someone please confirm for me that there is no size limit on g code for Centroid? That is the major reason I am doing this conversion. I want to machine complex 3D profiles that are large g code files.

As for the user interface / buttons. I am a little unsure of having no fixed X+,X-,Y+,Y-,Z+,Z- buttons. Switching between them on the MPG does seem tedious and easy to get the wrong axis. I can drive my buttons blind at the moment by feel. It is a must for me that the machine can be driven from its panel standalone without the keyboard and mouse (for normal job setup and running of programs).

That said, I had liked the idea of a single big touchscreen monitor with keyboard and mouse below it. That way I can run Fusion 360 or Solidworks or CAM packages right at the machine so when I want to quickly knock up or modify a part, it can all be done in one place.

Decisions are hard when there are too many options!

[martyscncgarage]

At some point you will have to remove that cover to gain access to the spindle motor.
What makes you CERTAIN it is a servo motor? Is it a big DC Brush Servo?

Between a touchscreen and the Wireless MPG you should be fine....In fact many are going without the touch screen and just using the Wireless MPG and getting a keyboard with touchpad and a wide screen monitor

[ashesman]

Hi Marty,

I have had the spindle servo cover off several times. It takes two people to get it off and not often someone here to help me. I don't think I need to go in there again for a while I hope. All the cabling is fitted and running to the control cabinet!

The motor looks identical to the other servo motors. Same frame size and everything. It is just a bit longer. It has the same shaped connectors and encoder in it. The part number MSM152B2A also suggests that it is an AC servo motor. The links below also suggest the same. Attached are the wiring diagrams for the Y axis and spindle motors, they are identical.

https://www.liveauctionworld.com/Mori-S ... _i32276549
https://industrial.panasonic.com/conten ... ctlg_e.pdf

So, a drive that can do 6000 + RPM, be it a servo drive or VFD that supports permanent magnet motors is what I am looking for. Got any suggestionss?

On a side note, after watching the videos on how the virtual panel can be configured, I feel a bit better about a touch screen. Depending on the budget left after I find a spindle drive, I might get a button control panel as well, although probably better spent on tool length probe!

[slodat]

Hitachi SJ-P1 says it will work with permanent magnet motors. I have this drive on two machines. Very happy with it.

[martyscncgarage]

Hitachi SJ-P1 says it will work with permanent magnet motors. I have this drive on two machines. Very happy with it.

Does it do spindle orient with an encoder?
Before I made the purchase, I would make sure it does that and get in contact with the manufacturer and ask if it will drive the Panasonic servo. Worth a Shot.

Otherwise I would look for a new spindle motor and drive that does spindle orient. That could be a large expense unless one found a motor and drive from a parted out machine.

[slodat]

Encoder interface is an option that goes in one the expansion ports on the drive. It will do spindle orient. This is covered in the manual. It is a full featured modern drive. It’s their top of the line model. And, they have a rating sheet for single phase supply.

[martyscncgarage]

Encoder interface is an option that goes in one the expansion ports on the drive. It will do spindle orient. This is covered in the manual. It is a full featured modern drive. It’s their top of the line model. And, they have a rating sheet for single phase supply.

Excellent! Thanks for the resource!

[slodat]

Hitachi SJ-P1 rating sheet for single phase supply.

Encoder Feedback Option (5V Differential LineDriver Input), Use with SJ-P1 Drives

Drives Watehouse has great service and pricing.

[ashesman]

Cool, thanks, I will look into that drive. I have the local ABB rep looking to see what he can come up with but I expect they will offer something crazy expensive and then have proprietary software you have to buy to configure it. That's usually how they roll!

From my understanding from what the Centroid tech guys have told me, Centroid can do spindle orient and rigid tapping with just the drive running in 0-10V variable speed mode. As long as the encoder goes to the Oak.

I don't really understand how you do precision high speed rigid tapping without a servo driven spindle??? This machine can do 4000 RPM rigid tapping with the current controller. It is a drilling and tapping machine by design. Like a Fanuc Robodrill. We tested it one time and it is astounding, just punches down and back up so quickly! I don't think Centroid supports proper servo driven rigid tapping but I guess it is what it is and as long as it does actually do tapping then its all good.

I am an embedded systems engineer, I spent ten years doing engine control firmware for timing of spark, fuel injection, variable valve timing with fraction of a degree precision at 18000 RPM. Hence why I am fussy about motor control and drivers! I am still hesitant and worried that I am not doing the right thing replacing the controller and this machine will not be as good as it is now (except for the things it is not good at now!).

Just for interest sake, I haven't found anything of huge significance in the Centroid software that this machine didn't do back in 1997. Quite surprising how advanced the technology was back then!

OK, off to checkout that Hitachi drive...

[martyscncgarage]

Cool, thanks, I will look into that drive. I have the local ABB rep looking to see what he can come up with but I expect they will offer something crazy expensive and then have proprietary software you have to buy to configure it. That's usually how they roll!

From my understanding from what the Centroid tech guys have told me, Centroid can do spindle orient and rigid tapping with just the drive running in 0-10V variable speed mode. As long as the encoder goes to the Oak.

I don't really understand how you do precision high speed rigid tapping without a servo driven spindle??? This machine can do 4000 RPM rigid tapping with the current controller. It is a drilling and tapping machine by design. Like a Fanuc Robodrill. We tested it one time and it is astounding, just punches down and back up so quickly! I don't think Centroid supports proper servo driven rigid tapping but I guess it is what it is and as long as it does actually do tapping then its all good.

I am an embedded systems engineer, I spent ten years doing engine control firmware for timing of spark, fuel injection, variable valve timing with fraction of a degree precision at 18000 RPM. Hence why I am fussy about motor control and drivers! I am still hesitant and worried that I am not doing the right thing replacing the controller and this machine will not be as good as it is now (except for the things it is not good at now!).

Just for interest sake, I haven't found anything of huge significance in the Centroid software that this machine didn't do back in 1997. Quite surprising how advanced the technology was back then!

OK, off to checkout that Hitachi drive...

As an aside, Centroid has been around for over 30 years doing machine motion control. The user interface is familiar across the software revisions. Just refined and features added along the way of course.

Good luck with your build.
Marty