Omnitech / Anderson Router as Project?

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jeingham
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Omnitech / Anderson Router as Project?

Post by jeingham »

All,

We picked up an old Omnitech / Anderson Selexx PAL CNC router and are looking at our option for bringing it back to life.

It is a complicated machine that was driven by Siemens 810D controller and other peripheral Siemens equipment.

It includes a tool changer for the primary Z axis, a multi spindle auxiliary drill head and several pneumatic operations for the dust skirt and the like.

Does anyone here have experience retrofitting such a machine using Centroid alone or integrating Centroid with the Siemens 810D and the Simatec S7 300 control System?

Here are a few images of this beast: https://photos.app.goo.gl/KN8bvFcjDaESPpk67

Any an all advice would be appreciated!

Thanks in advance...

John
cncsnw
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Re: Omnitech / Anderson Router as Project?

Post by cncsnw »

It is a reasonable retrofit candidate. There does not appear to be anything there that cannot be controlled with a Centroid control.

It would be fairly ambitious as one's second-ever DIY retrofit project.

The first questions you will need to address are whether you can reuse the servo drives or motors; and whether you can reuse the spindle drive for the main router spindle. To investigate that, you first need to identify the brand and models of the servo drives and spindle drive; then look through the existing machine documentation, and any drive documentation you can find online, to see what the control interface is for those drives.

In general, if the servo drives will run in an analog velocity mode, and if you can get quadrature differential encoder positions back out of them, then you can control them with a Centroid control. If the spindle drive will accept forward and reverse run enables, and an analog velocity reference, then you can run it with a Centroid control.
jeingham
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Re: Omnitech / Anderson Router as Project?

Post by jeingham »

@cncsnw

Good to know that Centroid is a possibility minimally.
cncsnw wrote: Mon Aug 10, 2020 9:34 pm It is a reasonable retrofit candidate.  There does not appear to be anything there that cannot be controlled with a Centroid control.
That's what I was thinking, complex but doable from all I've read here and elsewhere.
cncsnw wrote: Mon Aug 10, 2020 9:34 pm It would be fairly ambitious as one's second-ever DIY retrofit project.
Oh yeah, I feel exactly the same. We are open to the notion of having it done for us by someone with more experience and are actually looking at the possibility of reviving the existing Siemens controller as the majority of its components are still supported. Either way it is going to be challenge, especially for the nube.
cncsnw wrote: Mon Aug 10, 2020 9:34 pm The first questions you will need to address are whether you can reuse the servo drives or motors; and whether you can reuse the spindle drive for the main router spindle.  To investigate that, you first need to identify the brand and models of the servo drives and spindle drive; then look through the existing machine documentation, and any drive documentation you can find online, to see what the control interface is for those drives.

In general, if the servo drives will run in an analog velocity mode, and if you can get quadrature differential encoder positions back out of them, then you can control them with a Centroid control.  If the spindle drive will accept forward and reverse run enables, and an analog velocity reference, then you can run it with a Centroid control.
We are working to document all that now. I will present it here when we are finished. (It will be more than just me working on this project.)

I really appreciated the support I received here for my first project. It is actually about finished, final checks done. Will post the story soon.

John
martyscncgarage
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Re: Omnitech / Anderson Router as Project?

Post by martyscncgarage »

John, what part of the Country are you in? Marc is in the NW.
You could retain him to consult with if you decide to do the leg work yourself. He could help with PLC programming etc.
Just a thought.

If you can, post the model numbers of the drives and links to manuals.
Good luck with the project. Keep us posted if should you go the Centroid route. Centroid can do it. Its more a matter of how much of the drives you can or want to reuse.

Marty
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jeingham
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Re: Omnitech / Anderson Router as Project?

Post by jeingham »

martyscncgarage wrote: Tue Aug 11, 2020 5:37 pm John, what part of the Country are you in? Marc is in the NW.
You could retain him to consult with if you decide to do the leg work yourself. He could help with PLC programming etc.
Just a thought.
I think that is the direction we are headed in as I just heard from Siemens that the 810D is "Legacy" and no longer supported. They even pointed me to Centroid!

We are in Oakland CA.

Will PM Mark after we have a consensus as to how to proceed, or, Mark, please feel free to PM me your contact information if you like.

The machine was picked up for the cost of delivery here on the notion that we might need to go the Centroid route. We have a fair budget to get it done so retaining assistance is a possibility. I'd say with our Centroid experience level being what it is, help is pretty much required.
martyscncgarage wrote: Tue Aug 11, 2020 5:37 pm If you can, post the model numbers of the drives and links to manuals.
Good luck with the project. Keep us posted if should you go the Centroid route. Centroid can do it. Its more a matter of how much of the drives you can or want to reuse.
I am in the process of gathering all that information and will post when I am finished. Won't be too long now.

Thanks again...

John
martyscncgarage
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Re: Omnitech / Anderson Router as Project?

Post by martyscncgarage »

Look forward to seeing how you progress. Looks like a worth machine. Maybe the fact that the drivers are older and not supported by Siemens is a good thing. They could not provide documentation for their legacy drives?
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jeingham
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Re: Omnitech / Anderson Router as Project?

Post by jeingham »

Yes, I think it is a worthy machine too. The price was right for sure. It came with Becker blower and a large and hopefully functional spindle. The VFD started up without errors when we turned the machine on. Visual inspection revealed nothing of major concern to me and it has a the full complement of tools so we are hoping that we can work up to functional. We saw one working right next to it, amazingly fast compared to our old Rebel router. This machine will actually be our third retrofit, two other routers were done with Galil and Mach and of course there is the mill I just finishing up, Centroid.

There is one giant drive, the Simodrive 810D, that drives all the motors apparently. We have found a ton of documentation on that drive and other components we have identified so far. The PLCs, for instance, are very common even today and well documented by the looks of it. The big problem appears to be that Siemens has dropped the PC based interface that is integral to the 810D and the 810D itself, possibly. The PC based controller for 810D was based on Windows 98 so very likely a dead end there, certainly so by the Siemens tech we heard from. Modern versions of this machine use a Siemens pendent 'component' similar to many other modern CNC machines, big panel with flat key pads, built in LCD, MPG and etc.

I am not done researching and studying this machine by quite some so please take what I say here with a grain of salt!
martyscncgarage
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Re: Omnitech / Anderson Router as Project?

Post by martyscncgarage »

Post links to manuals for the drives here. Don't discount your servo drives yet. Need to see the documentation.
Reminder, for support please follow this post: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=383
We can't "SEE" what you see...
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repauli1
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Re: Omnitech / Anderson Router as Project?

Post by repauli1 »

What course of retrofit did you pursue? I am 75% done on an identical retrofit. Just removed tool changer yesterday to clean bearings and repack with grease. Hope to have tool changer complete by weekend. Then need to figure out vdrill head.
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