Communication Errors-Travel Limits spontaneously changed "0" & other issues

All things related to the Centroid Acorn CNC Controller

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carboncymbal
Posts: 22
Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2020 11:12 am
Acorn CNC Controller: Yes
Allin1DC CNC Controller: No
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: No
CPU10 or CPU7: No
CNC Control System Serial Number: 0035FF8A1900-10082038

Re: Travel Limits spontaneously changed "0" & other issues

Post by carboncymbal »

martyscncgarage wrote: Tue Jan 12, 2021 10:34 am
carboncymbal wrote: Tue Jan 12, 2021 10:27 am All,

I did not build these panels, please don’t feel the need to be sensitive about identifying wiring issues on my account. I’ll happily take any criticism of the wiring and use them to correct the issues.
I'm sorry to hear someone else created your issues. No support from them? No offer to correct?
You feel comfortable fixing things up?

Keep all your posts in this thread. We can scroll back if needed.

Marty
I don’t think I’ll have success with the original builder based on my interactions with him, and I don’t trust his judgement on design and build decisions for the electronics.. He did not charge me much above the cost of the components

I have done a reasonable amount of wiring (2 cnc controllers and a handful of PLC panels) in the past and have all of the tools to do a clean job. Fixing it myself will be faster and ensure it is done right I think.
martyscncgarage
Posts: 7131
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2017 12:01 pm
Acorn CNC Controller: Yes
Allin1DC CNC Controller: Yes
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: Yes
CPU10 or CPU7: Yes
CNC Control System Serial Number: none
Location: Mesa, AZ

Re: Travel Limits spontaneously changed "0" & other issues

Post by martyscncgarage »

carboncymbal wrote: Tue Jan 12, 2021 11:24 am
martyscncgarage wrote: Tue Jan 12, 2021 10:34 am
carboncymbal wrote: Tue Jan 12, 2021 10:27 am All,

I did not build these panels, please don’t feel the need to be sensitive about identifying wiring issues on my account. I’ll happily take any criticism of the wiring and use them to correct the issues.
I'm sorry to hear someone else created your issues. No support from them? No offer to correct?
You feel comfortable fixing things up?

Keep all your posts in this thread. We can scroll back if needed.

Marty
I don’t think I’ll have success with the original builder based on my interactions with him, and I don’t trust his judgement on design and build decisions for the electronics.. He did not charge me much above the cost of the components

I have done a reasonable amount of wiring (2 cnc controllers and a handful of PLC panels) in the past and have all of the tools to do a clean job. Fixing it myself will be faster and ensure it is done right I think.
Completely agree. Start over and clean it up.
Bench test, add one subsystem at a time and test before moving forward with the next.
Fuse properly.
Reminder, for support please follow this post: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=383
We can't "SEE" what you see...
Mesa, AZ
carboncymbal
Posts: 22
Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2020 11:12 am
Acorn CNC Controller: Yes
Allin1DC CNC Controller: No
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: No
CPU10 or CPU7: No
CNC Control System Serial Number: 0035FF8A1900-10082038

Re: Travel Limits spontaneously changed "0" & other issues

Post by carboncymbal »

martyscncgarage wrote: Tue Jan 12, 2021 11:29 am
carboncymbal wrote: Tue Jan 12, 2021 11:24 am
martyscncgarage wrote: Tue Jan 12, 2021 10:34 am

I'm sorry to hear someone else created your issues. No support from them? No offer to correct?
You feel comfortable fixing things up?

Keep all your posts in this thread. We can scroll back if needed.

Marty
I don’t think I’ll have success with the original builder based on my interactions with him, and I don’t trust his judgement on design and build decisions for the electronics.. He did not charge me much above the cost of the components

I have done a reasonable amount of wiring (2 cnc controllers and a handful of PLC panels) in the past and have all of the tools to do a clean job. Fixing it myself will be faster and ensure it is done right I think.
Completely agree. Start over and clean it up.
Bench test, add one subsystem at a time and test before moving forward with the next.
Fuse properly.
Marty, I’ll search the forum tonight, but are there any standard guides you are aware of for best wiring practices? I’m looking for things advice on
-VFD EMI filters
-what type/gauge of shielded wire
-grounding commons of power supplies (DC V-) vs floating commons
-grounding practices (as not to create a ground loop)
-the need for ferrites
-cable connectors vs hardwiring

Thanks,
Clay
martyscncgarage
Posts: 7131
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2017 12:01 pm
Acorn CNC Controller: Yes
Allin1DC CNC Controller: Yes
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: Yes
CPU10 or CPU7: Yes
CNC Control System Serial Number: none
Location: Mesa, AZ

Re: Travel Limits spontaneously changed "0" & other issues

Post by martyscncgarage »

Here is a system schematic from Centroid. I have never had the need for ferrites. Filters when called for.
It can give you some ideas. There is a schematic for the Clearpath SDSK servos as well.
(The entire schematic set can be downloaded from this page, about the middle: https://www.centroidcnc.com/centroid_di ... oller.html
Attachments
S14972-ACORN_rev4_MULTIPLE_CLEARPATH_SDSK_SERIES_MOTORS.pdf
(184.95 KiB) Downloaded 5 times
S15010-ACORN_rev4_STANDARD_SYSTEM.pdf
(403.76 KiB) Downloaded 4 times
Reminder, for support please follow this post: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=383
We can't "SEE" what you see...
Mesa, AZ
carboncymbal
Posts: 22
Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2020 11:12 am
Acorn CNC Controller: Yes
Allin1DC CNC Controller: No
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: No
CPU10 or CPU7: No
CNC Control System Serial Number: 0035FF8A1900-10082038

Re: Travel Limits spontaneously changed "0" & other issues

Post by carboncymbal »

OK. I did a bunch of testing have found a repeatable pattern of issues.

Machine condition- All screw terminal headers removed from Acorn except power power (DC-, DC+, and Ground), Relay board connected per bench test guidelines. Acorn remains in the panel. Shielded ethernet directly from PC to Acorn. VFD and other power supplies are also disconnected from power. Page 1 of acorn wizard set to bench test.

Lenovo Mini PC Results (report attached)

When connected to my Lenovo mini pc, communication errors were ALWAYS observed after the following steps
1. Acorn was removed from power for 3 minutes
2. Acorn powered on
3. CNC 12 started

This usually started with 2 errors right at startup and a report that the E stop was triggered (when it wasn't).

The system would typically operate error free if the following sequence was taken
1. ACORN was powered for 10 minutes
2. power was cycled on the panel briefly (off/on within 3 seconds)
3 CNC 12 restarted

I could then typically run several minutes of Gcode (example files provided by centroid) without the common communication errors. I ended the program to check for errors after 2 minutes.

I also tested my laptop. I had no communication errors at all, even when following the first sequence of steps which resulted in errors in EVERY SINGLE TEST on the lenovo mini PC (probably 15 tests using that sequence over the last 2 days).

I alternated the tests between the Lenovo PC and the Laptop 3 times using the first procedure. In each case following the the sequence of steps, the laptop had no errors and the mini PC had significant errors.

2 other points for your consideration.
  • This desktop is powered with a 2 prong plug (no ground)
    I tested the desktop plugged into 2 independent plugs (the second one being a 120 outlet that I installed weeks ago for this project that I know to be was grounded in the breaker panel (Although I haven't tested beyond that)
Attachments
report_0035FF8A1900-1008203805_2021-01-13_23-31-34.zip
(604.87 KiB) Downloaded 2 times
martyscncgarage
Posts: 7131
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2017 12:01 pm
Acorn CNC Controller: Yes
Allin1DC CNC Controller: Yes
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: Yes
CPU10 or CPU7: Yes
CNC Control System Serial Number: none
Location: Mesa, AZ

Re: Travel Limits spontaneously changed "0" & other issues

Post by martyscncgarage »

So your Lenovo Tiny is suspect. Did you try and plug that PC in another independent or isolated outlet?
Did you use the Lenovo manager to check the PC for all updates including BIOS?

I have had this happen to me with a Lenovo Tiny M92P a couple of times. My Tiny Power Supplies are all three prong Lenovo supplies. Not sure if that is going to make any difference because the output is DC.
Try a new Intel NUC

Marty
Reminder, for support please follow this post: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=383
We can't "SEE" what you see...
Mesa, AZ
carboncymbal
Posts: 22
Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2020 11:12 am
Acorn CNC Controller: Yes
Allin1DC CNC Controller: No
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: No
CPU10 or CPU7: No
CNC Control System Serial Number: 0035FF8A1900-10082038

Re: Travel Limits spontaneously changed "0" & other issues

Post by carboncymbal »

martyscncgarage wrote: Thu Jan 14, 2021 7:14 am So your Lenovo Tiny is suspect. Did you try and plug that PC in another independent or isolated outlet?
Did you use the Lenovo manager to check the PC for all updates including BIOS?

I have had this happen to me with a Lenovo Tiny M92P a couple of times. My Tiny Power Supplies are all three prong Lenovo supplies. Not sure if that is going to make any difference because the output is DC.
Try a new Intel NUC

Marty
I did try independent outlets including one with a direct 15 foot wire connection to a breaker panel. Should have a solid ground. I did use the Lenovo update tool prior tool when configuring the system initially , and again as I started having issues.

These power supplies are actually 3 prong as well, but there it seems as though the ground doesn’t go beyond the power brick. I can’t detect continuity between the power cord ground and the computer chassis.

I’m going to test another desktop computer tonight or tomorrow in the same location.

Thanks,
Clay
carboncymbal
Posts: 22
Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2020 11:12 am
Acorn CNC Controller: Yes
Allin1DC CNC Controller: No
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: No
CPU10 or CPU7: No
CNC Control System Serial Number: 0035FF8A1900-10082038

Re: Travel Limits spontaneously changed "0" & other issues

Post by carboncymbal »

I did it check for a BIOS update, good thought, I will do that tonight.
carboncymbal
Posts: 22
Joined: Tue Dec 15, 2020 11:12 am
Acorn CNC Controller: Yes
Allin1DC CNC Controller: No
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: No
CPU10 or CPU7: No
CNC Control System Serial Number: 0035FF8A1900-10082038

Re: Travel Limits spontaneously changed "0" & other issues

Post by carboncymbal »

Ok, I have 2 identical lenovo computers with 2 identical control panels. Both are experiencing the same issues in a nearly bench test conditions as described above. They are also in 2 separate locations, an hour away from each other.

There are all running current drivers and BIOS.

This really indicates to me that the issue is with the computers.

Any thoughts on if this can be resolved?

Thanks,
Clay
martyscncgarage
Posts: 7131
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2017 12:01 pm
Acorn CNC Controller: Yes
Allin1DC CNC Controller: Yes
Oak CNC controller: No
MPU11 & GPIO4D -w/ 3rd Party Drives: No
DC3IOB: No
CNC12: Yes
CNC11: Yes
CPU10 or CPU7: Yes
CNC Control System Serial Number: none
Location: Mesa, AZ

Re: Travel Limits spontaneously changed "0" & other issues

Post by martyscncgarage »

carboncymbal wrote: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:07 pm Ok, I have 2 identical lenovo computers with 2 identical control panels. Both are experiencing the same issues in a nearly bench test conditions as described above. They are also in 2 separate locations, an hour away from each other.

There are all running current drivers and BIOS.

This really indicates to me that the issue is with the computers.

Any thoughts on if this can be resolved?

Thanks,
Clay
Get an Intel NUC or another computer with an ethernet port and test.
I am wondering if it is an updated driver issue.....
Might be time to move on to NUC's as they are newer.

But the point is, don't discount the computer as the source of the errors. I am told the BBG has the same fixed ethernet drivers. I don't know if this could be a timing issue or what....
Marty
Reminder, for support please follow this post: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=383
We can't "SEE" what you see...
Mesa, AZ
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