Hercus Turret Macro

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Upnorth
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Hercus Turret Macro

Post by Upnorth »

I have a Hercus compulathe currently running on Mach 3. I have never used the turret with Mach 3. I'm very happy with the acorn I put on the mill so I am interested in putting an acorn on the lathe as well. Here is what I want to know. Has anyone wrote a macro that would control this turret? I'm not very good at writing in computer language.

From what I can tell this is how the turret works. To select tool position it can only revolve in one direction I will call this forward. It rotates forward until it gets an index pulse from the home micro switch. This indicates home. If home is the required position it would not stop and reverse for a short interval. There is a separate switch that pulses every time it passes another slot position. When the turret arrives at the requested position it stops then reverses. It mechanically locks and another micro switch indicates the turret is locked. This ends the tool change. The turret has 8 tool positions. It would be good if the macro knew the tool position so it did not have to go past home every time.

I can probably edit a macro that is close but starting from scratch is not something I want to do.
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Re: Hercus Turret Macro

Post by cnckeith »

Need support? READ THIS POST first. http://centroidcncforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=60&t=1043
All Acorn Documentation is located here: viewtopic.php?f=60&t=3397
Answers to common questions: viewforum.php?f=63
and here viewforum.php?f=61
Gear we use but don't sell. https://www.centroidcnc.com/centroid_di ... _gear.html
martyscncgarage
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Re: Hercus Turret Macro

Post by martyscncgarage »

Upnorth wrote: Mon Jun 08, 2020 8:03 am I have a Hercus compulathe currently running on Mach 3. I have never used the turret with Mach 3. I'm very happy with the acorn I put on the mill so I am interested in putting an acorn on the lathe as well. Here is what I want to know. Has anyone wrote a macro that would control this turret? I'm not very good at writing in computer language.

From what I can tell this is how the turret works. To select tool position it can only revolve in one direction I will call this forward. It rotates forward until it gets an index pulse from the home micro switch. This indicates home. If home is the required position it would not stop and reverse for a short interval. There is a separate switch that pulses every time it passes another slot position. When the turret arrives at the requested position it stops then reverses. It mechanically locks and another micro switch indicates the turret is locked. This ends the tool change. The turret has 8 tool positions. It would be good if the macro knew the tool position so it did not have to go past home every time.

I can probably edit a macro that is close but starting from scratch is not something I want to do.
You HAVE to nail down how the turret operates before we can give you assistance.
Are there videos of one operating on YouTube? Ask the author how it operates
Sounds like it is uni directional (Turns one direction)
Sounds like it has a home switch and a tool counter?
What kind of motor on the turret? DC? How much voltage does it take to roll it forward? How much voltage does it take to roll it backward? Does the roll back voltage keep it against a "pawl" Is there a solenoid driven turret lock?

Keith posted a link to some of the ATC/Turret Macros.

I would put the turret on the bench, figure out how it works, take voltage readings, check sensor operation etc. Try and find a user who already has one working and ask specifically how it works and each step.

Marty
Reminder, for support please follow this post: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=383
We can't "SEE" what you see...
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Upnorth
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Re: Hercus Turret Macro

Post by Upnorth »

Thanks Keith that is what I was looking for to get started. I did look for that but was not able to find it. I was not sure where I had seen it before but it looks familiar. I'll read through them and see if one is close so I can modify it to suit my turret.

Thanks for responding Marty. The description I gave on how it operates is accurate except I made an error on the home. Basically it rotates forward until it passes the selected position then reverses to lock.

To answer your questions. Yes it is unidirectional. As soon as you reverse it the turret will lock. It does use a home switch and a macro based counter. The motor is a small DC 2 pole motor. Uses 24 volts if I remember right but that is not a problem for me. I am ok with the mechanics just not the control macro part. It uses the same voltage forward or backward. I can actually manually control the turret with a battery by just applying forward voltage to get to the desired position and reversing the voltage to go to the lock position. The lock is mechanical. It does not require an applied voltage after it locks. After reversing for a preselected time it looks for a change in the state of the turret locked switch. If it is not locked it should fault out and indicate the turret is not locked.

I do have most of a service manual for the turret. It gives a detailed description of how it works. Its a bit confusing in the manual though.
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Re: Hercus Turret Macro

Post by martyscncgarage »

What is the voltage to the turret motor to reverse, and hold the turret against the lock? It is not usually the full 24VDC. There may be some voltage dividing circuit to half that. You can tell by watching the turret speed when it rotates forward vs. reverse if the voltage is reduced in reverse.

Is there a video of one of these lathes/turrets on YouTube you can point us to?
The PLC can handle most anything. Its whether or not Centroid has one canned to work, or one needs some slight modifications to work with your turret. Their hourly rate is worth it. But you have to be very clear on how the turret operates.

Marty
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Upnorth
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Re: Hercus Turret Macro

Post by Upnorth »

I'll check later I think I have the schematic somewhere and see about the voltage.When I bought the lathe it had no electronics so I never saw the turret operate with its original control.

If you want to see a turret like mine there is one in this video. Tool change you can see is at 1:20. I should have pointed about earlier I'm not opposed to paying someone to make a macro for me. I'm certain it will be cheaper than all the time I will waste trying to figure it out for myself.
martyscncgarage
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Re: Hercus Turret Macro

Post by martyscncgarage »

Sounds like a solenoid locking the turret at the end of a tool change? Centroid has a PLC that works with 4 bit gray logic now.

I would put the turret on the bench and figure out how it works. Schematics and parts break down helps. Scan those pages and post them, maybe one of us can help with a look?
Reminder, for support please follow this post: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=383
We can't "SEE" what you see...
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Upnorth
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Re: Hercus Turret Macro

Post by Upnorth »

There is no solenoid that locks.Its mechanical only. When the turret locks it ouputs a signal through a microswitch. I have decided to dump mach 3 and order an acorn for the lathe. I did the bench check thing a while ago. That is where the description of how it operates came from.
Upnorth
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Re: Hercus Turret Macro

Post by Upnorth »

Been a while but I recently put an acorn on the lathe and am now solving the usual stuff that crops up with a new install.

I'm now back to getting the turret to work. I don't want to do a macro from scratch so I'm looking at editing one. I have never made a macro before and have little experience with writing any sort of code.

The counter based turret macro for the emco is very close to what I need to do. The difference is instead of the turret reversing on release of the forward relay I would need a separate output to reverse the turret for about a second to engage the mechanical lock. Then turn off. I don't need voltage applied to keep the turret in the lock position.

Second after the reverse is complete I need to read an input to see if the turret locked. If it's locked it can proceed if not all action stops and an error message is displayed.

What I would like to know is can I edit the counter based turret macro provided by Centroid? Is so how can I open it for editing.
martyscncgarage
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Re: Hercus Turret Macro

Post by martyscncgarage »

Look at the Acorn 2 output gray code Lathe ATC. It uses a FORWARD and REVERSE output. But currently it uses Gray Code Logic for tool positions.
Please explain how the turret "counts" positions? How did the original control know the tool position?
If you posted its schematic, it would be tremendously helpful.
Marty
Reminder, for support please follow this post: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=383
We can't "SEE" what you see...
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