Shopbot PRS 48x96 Acorn / Clearpath Conversion

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paulwall
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Re: Shopbot PRS 48x96 Acorn / Clearpath Conversion

Post by paulwall »

I didn't get the programming wire, but I do have a couple USB extension cables laying around I should be able to use for tuning and setup.

Did have a question today though - I want to have 24v indicator LEDs on the outside of my enclosure to show power status to both the VFD and servo PSU contactors.

Is the best practice for driving these kind of status LEDs inline on the low voltage (24v) e-stop circuit, or by completing the circuit to light the LED through the high-voltage pole?
carbuthn
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Re: Shopbot PRS 48x96 Acorn / Clearpath Conversion

Post by carbuthn »

I don't recommend putting the led in series with the coil. If you have an extra contact you can use that.

On my setup I use one contact for the 120 line, one for neutral and one for indication. You may need a contact for maintaining the on status of the contactor (I maintain mine on via the seal in on the separate PLC not the plc on the Acorn). You should use a quench arc if you are controlling the coil from the Acorn or other digital source.

You can also added either 2 or 4 additional auxiliary contacts for a few extra dollars.
Chuck

Contactor that I use, L1 Line, L2 Neutral, 13/14 NO for Indication and A1/A2 are the coil conections
l_cwc0161030v04.jpg
The quench arc plugs into the right side of the contactor face
l_vrc01e49.jpg
Auxiliary contact block
l_bfc011.jpg
paulwall
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Re: Shopbot PRS 48x96 Acorn / Clearpath Conversion

Post by paulwall »

carbuthn wrote: Sun Jun 14, 2020 9:29 pm I don't recommend putting the led in series with the coil. If you have an extra contact you can use that.

On my setup I use one contact for the 120 line, one for neutral and one for indication. You may need a contact for maintaining the on status of the contactor (I maintain mine on via the seal in on the separate PLC not the plc on the Acorn). You should use a quench arc if you are controlling the coil from the Acorn or other digital source.

You can also added either 2 or 4 additional auxiliary contacts for a few extra dollars.
Chuck

Contactor that I use, L1 Line, L2 Neutral, 13/14 NO for Indication and A1/A2 are the coil conections
l_cwc0161030v04.jpg
The quench arc plugs into the right side of the contactor face
l_vrc01e49.jpg
Auxiliary contact block
l_bfc011.jpg
That's a lot of info, thanks for the input. Just to clarify, this method you're describing here is the preferred method for indicator lighting assuming that light (LED in this case) is of the same voltage as what's passing through the primary contactor switch? Thus meaning I would need to find 240v LEDs.

To avoid having high voltage wiring throughout my enclosure to drive some LEDs, is an alternative solution to drive low voltage LEDs (12 or 24v) switched on directly from separate output relays off the Acorn relay board at the same triggering as the relays that drive the high voltage contactors?
carbuthn
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Re: Shopbot PRS 48x96 Acorn / Clearpath Conversion

Post by carbuthn »

No, that is wrong. You would use the Auxiliary or Spare contact to control the LED. The LED in the Control Switch that I use is 24 vdc. You can get the for 5, 12, 24, 48, 120 or 220 vac/vdc (plus other voltages).

The reason for not putting them in series with the coil is that the LED has a resistor to limit the current through the LED (normal about 20 milli-amps) that may not be enough to reliably operate the coil.
Chuck
Control Switch, led goes in the middle between two switches
CSW2-BDSI21SSF_main-1.jpg
LED Module, contains resistor and LED
CSW-BIDL0E26_main-1.jpg
CSW2-BDSI21SSF_main-4.jpg
paulwall
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Re: Shopbot PRS 48x96 Acorn / Clearpath Conversion

Post by paulwall »

Thanks a ton Chuck, I think I understand now.

So here is my power and e-stop schematic. It's pretty chaotic but checks out for as good as my understanding allows it to. Very much looking for feedback! I think for the most part all the other wiring is pretty straight forward for getting the VFD up, and my servos connected.

Image

Edit: There's a lot wrong with this schematic, don't use it.
Last edited by paulwall on Sat Jan 02, 2021 3:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
carbuthn
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Re: Shopbot PRS 48x96 Acorn / Clearpath Conversion

Post by carbuthn »

Paul,
That's a pretty involved schematic. Without seeing the actual machine it is hard to say if it is correct. I was not sure of the wire that goes to the Primary (assume contactor, it was not showing the coil terminal).

On my lathe I had only e-stop two contacts, one provided an e-stop to the acorn (removed forward and reverse from the vfd and stopped the steps from going to the servos), the second was in series with the coil of a contactor that removed AC power from the servo Power Supply etc.

You can use one contactor controlled by the e-stop switch to interrupt power to the drives and vfd.

I made a connection table to help me wire things up correctly (yours will be different) but it tells me the wiring colors, and terminals. I kept a copy with me to add connections as I went. Checked them off as completed. It will also help me remember why I did what I did in the future. I attached the file as an example only.
Chuck
Terminal Connections.pdf
(188.03 KiB) Downloaded 143 times
tkbot47
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Re: Shopbot PRS 48x96 Acorn / Clearpath Conversion

Post by tkbot47 »

Paul,
Are you planning to run all devices on 240v or 120V? - I don't see a neutral, but the legs are both labeled 110V HOT.
paulwall
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Re: Shopbot PRS 48x96 Acorn / Clearpath Conversion

Post by paulwall »

tkbot47 wrote: Thu Jun 18, 2020 3:26 pm Paul,
Are you planning to run all devices on 240v or 120V? - I don't see a neutral, but the legs are both labeled 110V HOT.
Hey Tom, to the best of my knowledge in Cook county here in Chicago, single phase 240v comes in as 2 hot 120v lines connected at the transformer outside of the house thus not requiring the neutral. I've wired a few 240v appliances and tools in this same configuration without issue.

But if I am doing this wrong, someone certainly speak up!
tkbot47
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Re: Shopbot PRS 48x96 Acorn / Clearpath Conversion

Post by tkbot47 »

The 240V 1ph I know comes in to the house as a 4 wire - 2 hots with 240 between them 180 deg out of phase, one neutral with 120V 1ph between either hot and the neutral, and one gnd. You need a neutral to get 120V from that configuration. If you have a voltmeter and connect it between your red and back 240 hots, you should get 240V. While you can physically get 120V between either leg and the gnd wire, you're not supposed to use gnd that way. Gnd is only for a safety return back to the breaker box if one of your devices fails and AC goes to gnd, instead of going through you to ground. It is not to be used as neutral. Most of the devices in your box (not sure about your computer or monitor) can be wired to operate on 240 the way you have it wired, but you have to set it up that way. I believe the IPC-5 needs a wiring change in the plug to run 240V.

I would recommend running your box and motors on a separate 120V 1ph, run through an EMI filtered surge protector, and run separate 240V for the VFD/spindle. That way you just have 240V coming in to the contactor, and right back out to the VFD. If you have an HSD spindle from SB, the cooing fan is probably 24V DC - mine was.
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Re: Shopbot PRS 48x96 Acorn / Clearpath Conversion

Post by tblough »

"Ground" is a safety circuit and should not be used to carry current. When 240V split phase (normal US residential supply) enters the house at the main breaker panel, ground and neutral are connected together at this ONE POINT ONLY.

As tkbot47 states, the two hot legs are 180 degrees out of phase, so between the two hots you have 240V. Between either hot and NEUTRAL you have 120V. If you want to have 120/240 at the same time, you need 4 wires; hot #1 (usually black), hot #2 (usually red), neutral (white), and ground (green).

If you use the ground for the 120V return, you could potentially have 120V exposed on the "grounded" metal parts of your machine if a component fails shorted instead of open. Not something recommended for healthy living!
Cheers,

Tom
Confidence is the feeling you have before you fully understand the situation.
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