Router related questions.

[Black Forest]

That is great news Keith! What a great company Centroid is to work with and use their equipment!

[Black Forest]

Just my .02 on the subject. You really have to ask yourself is it reasonable to ask for the high end features on a controller of this price point. I bet many of you are here because you found how much of a bargain Acorn is what you get for the money given all its standard features. It won't work for everybody but I think for a good majority it will or they will find a way to make it work.

Marty

That's my point. Asking for independent homing of the slaved axis isn't "high end" or shouldn't be. IF providing the ability to slave axis then It should be a standard feature just like homing is for a single axis.
I agree that doesn't need to be advanced homing and automatically square etc but MUST do simple homing if to be taken seriously for router usage.

Routers or better phrased Gantry Style machines are very versatile machines which have a wide varied range of usages other than cutting wood.
Which is where we probably differ in seeing things regards whats MUST HAVE feature.

I've built Custom gantry style machines for cutting Paper, fiberglass, Neoprene, Fabrics, Glass, Stone. Foam and plasma, some of which have been 40' long 10' wide. So on a machine like this it becomes very important slaved axis can independently home.
The machines are often only ever going to cut one material all it's working life and don't need to be massively built or require high end hardware. So using high-cost servo's isn't practical. So low-cost stepper motors are a perfect match, however, this means independent homing is MUST have feature on such large lite framed machines.

Often the Machine users have very specific needs regards positioning etc. Be this for ATC, tool changing or work loading or holding etc but all of this is MY job to provide in form of macros/code etc which is easy enough done. BUT IMO the basics of independent Homing should be provided by Centroid if slaving feature is included in software/hardware.!

Personaly don't think it's asking too much for simple homing method.

With the cost of servos and drives being so inexpensive now I can not understand why anyone would use steppers. It makes no sense to me business wise either as an end user or an OEM. It use to be tuning the servos was a big chore and everyone except the experts shied away from them for that reason and the expense but now those roadblocks are pretty much gone. Also with the internet allowing companies such as Centroid to log onto a system around the world and have a look to see what is what eliminates so many of the pitfalls of owning equipment. Companies such as Delta offer quality servos and drives with auto tuning software at such low prices it just makes no sense business wise to offer/use steppers. It also makes designing machines easier if you use servos. Much less restrictions on direct drive or ratio reductions, etc.,etc..

[martyscncgarage]

we had a huddle today on Acorn paired axis CNC router "Auto squaring while homing" capability.
good news is that is can be done with existing firmware and CNC12 software, but it does require some code to be added to the PLC program.
So we will add this solution to the v4.12 release.

Great news Keith sounds like V4.12 will have features geared toward router users.
Thanks for all the effort being put forth into Acorn & CNC12.
Much appreciated.
Sounds like I'll be back to install the upgrade on the Phoenix 4x4 router I'm about to start.
Marty

[jazzcnc]

we had a huddle today on Acorn paired axis CNC router "Auto squaring while homing" capability.
good news is that is can be done with existing firmware and CNC12 software, but it does require some code to be added to the PLC program.
So we will add this solution to the v4.12 release.

Now thats impressive and how company should respond.
Can not tell you how many emails pleading with Cslabs for this feature to be added to there Mid range controller only to fall on deaf ears. I'm not easily impressed or won over but you have earnt my fullest respect with this one response. I will sing your praise to all this side of the pond.! Would say all us Europeans but we Brits just decided to dump the Rif Raf..Lol

Thank you All.

[jazzcnc]

With the cost of servos and drives being so inexpensive now I can not understand why anyone would use steppers. It makes no sense to me business wise either as an end user or an OEM. It use to be tuning the servos was a big chore and everyone except the experts shied away from them for that reason and the expense but now those roadblocks are pretty much gone. Also with the internet allowing companies such as Centroid to log onto a system around the world and have a look to see what is what eliminates so many of the pitfalls of owning equipment. Companies such as Delta offer quality servos and drives with auto tuning software at such low prices it just makes no sense business wise to offer/use steppers. It also makes designing machines easier if you use servos. Much less restrictions on direct drive or ratio reductions, etc.,etc..

While I agree Servo's have reduced in price and got much easier regards tuning the cost differences are still quite large when you look at the big picture.
Cabling alone for servos can cost more than full Stepper system inc drives and motors. Then you have to factor in things like line reactors for filtering the electricity supply due to servos being much more fussy about the quality of electricity and noise etc.
Also on the direct drive side and reductions etc it's common to find servos being reduced for various reasons or isolated from direct drive to avoid harmonics issues. IE Rack pinion systems can cause all sorts issues for servos if direct driven.

When you factor all these things together the cost is still substantial compared to stepper system.
To me Routers are like tractors they don't need 12cyc Ferrari engine, good Old straight Six does the job fine with plenty of power, costs less and last's for years without much maintenance, Plus any old boy with pair pliers and multi meter can figure out any issues.

End of the day often Budgets dictate to final machine spec.

[Gary Campbell]

we had a huddle today on Acorn paired axis CNC router "Auto squaring while homing" capability.
good news is that is can be done with existing firmware and CNC12 software, but it does require some code to be added to the PLC program.
So we will add this solution to the v4.12 release.

This is excellent news! I cant wait till the release of v4.12.

Thanks to all

[cbb1962]

I am going to upgrade my machine. I have been investigating UCCNC and the Centroid Acorn. To me, the Acorn wins hands down. I am running a Chinese router with a Mach3 3-axis XHC controller, Leadshine D542 Stepper drives, and a Fuling inverter for a 2.2 KW Spindle. I do manual tool changes. There are certain things about Mach3 that I do like, but overall it seems too quirky. I use the 2010 custom screen-set from cncwoodworker.com it allows for the fixed Z method described below:

All but the least featured control systems have a method for manual tool change, which allows multiple bits in one file (a true job), moving to a predetermined bit change location, pausing to allow operator to change out the bit, then prompting him to jog to the preferred Z zero location for loose plate zero, or rapid move to fixed location Z setter, back to location (if needed) to reinstall dust shoe, ask for operator input [ENTER] then file proceeds to completion or next tool call. My guess: 5-6%

I don't know what I would do without this method. Once I had the Chinese hardware complications straightened out, this method eliminated ALL of my tool setting issues.

Mach 3 also has a webcam plugin for alignment, I utilize a cheap USB endoscope that works well. I set the camera offset and press a button in the 2010 screen-set to zero to the offset. That works very well. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eba9nHt821s

@cnckeith when is the new version scheduled for release? Can you let us know what router specific enhancements are in it?

Thanks
Clint

[cnckeith]

you can do all these items discussed in this thread now with the current mill version of CNC12, you'll just have to write the macros to do it.

as mentioned earlier, the router version of Acorn cnc12 is in the works as i type.. we are also adding other big ticket items at the same time to v4.12 (atc wizard, wireless mpg support) so its gonna be a little while for proper beta testing to be performed before v4.12 release. my guess is mid March. I need router beta testers willing to put the time and energy into thorough beta software testing so if you are interested shoot me a PM but, before you do realize... it is work being a beta tester!

[martyscncgarage]

you can do all these items discussed in this thread now with the current mill version of CNC12, you'll just have to write the macros to do it.

as mentioned earlier, the router version of Acorn cnc12 is in the works as i type.. we are also adding other big ticket items at the same time to v4.12 (atc wizard, wireless mpg support) so its gonna be a little while for proper beta testing to be performed before v4.12 release. my guess is mid March. I need router beta testers willing to put the time and energy into thorough beta software testing so if you are interested shoot me a PM but, before you do realize... it is work being a beta tester!

I can attest to this fact. If you do volunteer, it is very important you FOLLOW THROUGH. Many people get excited and volunteer and then find out how much is involved and vanish. However, those that do stay up certainly help flesh out issues and improve the software and its great to be part of that process. Its an ON GOING process.....

Marty

[jazzcnc]

I need router beta testers willing to put the time and energy into thorough beta software testing so if you are interested shoot me a PM but, before you do realize... it is work being a beta tester!